The pool has nothing to do with it. Definitions and Sources of Law. We were both in agreement to pay half each. Anyway, now that I told my story, I want to get your opinion on whether or not I was within my rights (morally and legally), to refuse to pay for a decorative front yard fence that solely compliments his landscape and is not standard in our neighborhood (even though I did end up paying). I asked a contractor how much to tear down my older wooden fence. While these panels may look nice on the store shelves, they are made from inferior wood products and generally all the lumber is dimensionally smaller. I am not quite sure I fully understand your question. He insists that he could build his side of the wooden fence and our other side if I split the cost with him. I would still consider paying him a curtsey fee, yet am certainly less inclined to do so now. For the law to be on his side he would have had to give you a 30 day Notice to Alter Shared Boundary. Except as provided in paragraph (1), the action shall be filed in superior court and, notwithstanding Section 1141.13 of the Code of Civil Procedure, the action shall be subject to judicial arbitration pursuant to Chapter 2.5 of Title 3 of Part 3 (commencing with Section 1141.10) of the Code of Civil Procedure. The fence does not enclose their front yard but is still a neighboring fence. Our backyard back fence ( about 100 feet long) had a wooden fence built on our property. Of course, like many laws there are exceptions. Cite this article: FindLaw.com - California Code, Civil Code - CIV 841 - last updated January 01, 2019 The property line shows that the easement belongs to my neighbors parcel. Pursuant to Civil Code Section 841.4, a "fence or other structure in the nature of a fence unnecessarily exceeding 10 feet in height maliciously erected or maintained for the purpose of annoying the owner or occupant of adjoining property is a private nuisance." The fence its in a really bad condition. The good news, you have absolutely nothing to worry about. text messages, etc.) The spiders build their webs on the 2x4s and birds perch on the 2x4s. My husband nailed planks on the fence to cover the 2x4s. How do I keep the gap clear or how can I get my neighbor to allow a new fence on the property line (since he has 2 large dogs it cant come down without his participation)? I still cant see this fence from my property. The neighbor is legally responsible to pay for half the fence but only for a fence of similar design not one that is upgraded or more expensive as in a vinyl fence. Civ. This type of question has not been answered since the fence had NOT fallen over and was being maintained but was just not as pretty or strong as when new and so was replaced. In determining whether equal responsibility for the reasonable costs would be unjust, One neighbor is not financially able to split the cost but said he would try and chip in what he could. The next day, while I was gone, the neighbor came to my wife very agitated and critical, saying, how inconsiderate this was for us to do, how could we, and it was his fence and we were using it and encroaching on his property. Do we owe anyliability and responsibility to the neighbors? Yet, if the yards were already fenced in previously, and if you have other fences connecting to the one in question, you are more than likely going to get a judgment against you for half the cost. Now there are two fences that not only a too totally different styles but heights. 858.527.0111 | fax 858.527.1531 . I live in a cul-de-sac and the neighbor on the corner backyard fence backs into my front yard. I told him that this was not my fence, and explained the history. Legal Help for Real Estate Ownership and Title - Fences and Walls: CALIFORNIA We have a bid from a licensed contractor for $1300 to replace the fence and. Thanks for any time you spend reading about my situation. He should have sent the notice to you 30 days prior to the construction of the fence and should have sent it to you certified mail with the return receipt requested. 3 quotes The fence is horrible now because it does not match existing and neighbor says too bad, that I had agreed to the estimate, even though I had sent link to what I wanted. The neighbor is bullying you in order to make money off you. By Terry Higgins in forum Real Estate Ownership and Title Replies: 1 Last Post: 10-11-2009, 08:57 AM. While I understand the question is a general legal question and the contractor area of expertise does not matter, I would still feel more comfortable directing you to a knowledgeable attorney in your area! They said that they would give us permission when we asked, to enter their backyard by their stairs on the other side of their house, which would then involve us or workers to have to cross their whole backyard, which is an artificial grass putting green! Next door landlord(just purchased the land) approach me daughter of owner of the house & ask to sloppy cost on shared fence that was very water damaged. It is very good you havent paid anything for it yet. Thank you for your article. What was the outcome regarding the neighbors trees/vegetation ruining your fence? Your neighbor did not follow the proper procedure in order to go after you under the CA Good Neighbor Law for half the costs. It was always referred to as their fence, and nobody else could touch it. My question how do I attach/extend to the existing fence (which the neighbor project managed/paid in his name)? In short, each owner has to pay one-half of the cost of maintaining or replacing the fence. Coterminous owners are mutually bound equally to maintain: 1. They had a 5 day notice from time of the written letter to the fence being repaired. We saved all receipts from the hardware store. The builder had built a fence between my neighbor and me ( there was no fence on that side of the neighbors property before). So he got one estimate and paid the company and then demanded I pay half. The answer is a definite NO She cannot make up the rules and make you agree to her installing the fence while you pay for all the materials. Our properties backup to a small slope. | https://codes.findlaw.com/ca/civil-code/civ-sect-841/. So now HOA is advising me to serve her with the 30 days notice and if she still refuses to then take her to small claims to have the judge order her to agree to the fence replacement and payment. Also, the new fence could not be an unnecessary upgrade from the previous fence. The existing fence isnt bad at all. I gave them 15 days to accomplish this and also gave my phone number. Now in your case it seems that although it was a custom built fence and not prefabricated panels, it was very poorly built and looks terrible? Would have to agree with Potential Customer partly. Our neighbors property has their front yard side fence built on their property, parallel to our fence, about 16 inches from our fence along the entire way. That neighbor has since moved and a new owner bought the house as a rental property. It gets a little complicated when it comes to retaining walls. That could mean you document the bad shape of the fence and just build it exactly on the property line, while leaving the bad fence on his property, and then send him a bill for half. If he continues to do so anyway, call the cops. Our situation is somewhat different then what I have yet read. Never asked for financial help. Part of the fence is now leaning into the neighbors property. Although I was not informed in advance, not included in the planning, never saw a quote or even a final bill, I felt bullied, and paid him the $500. I built my house many years ago. The new neighbor had a dog and wished to build a fenced-in yard, the 1st on our side of the street. The property then can neither be sold nor refinanced without paying the outstanding judgement, which accrues interest! Are we under any legal obligation to pay him a penny? Neighbor wont negotiate further and wants me to pay half now to a terrible looking mismatch. The fence needs to replace much of it because of the poor maintenance on my neighbors side. He said that would be nice, as most people do not do that. Michael, thanks for the question. Who knows, if this were allowed to take place a neighbor could hire their cousin lets say and pay him whatever fee and then later claim the costs were way higher than actually paid in order to make him or his family member/ associate some extra money. There better be good reasons other than make my yard look better. I share a fence that is 75 long with a neighbor. We are planning on filling our in-ground pool and need a shared fence temporarily removed to allow for pool demolition equipment to enter the backyard. The California legislature amended Civil Code Section 841, effective January 1, 2014, to clarify in modern English the statute's original intent, i.e., that neighbors gain mutual benefits from the construction and maintenance of a boundary fence between their properties and are therefore appropriately presumed to share equally in the need to contribute to the construction and maintenance of . 2. Anyway, can they sue me for 1/2 the cost of this ? Cal. He also damaged a small two foot retaining wall that serves in that corner of my yard as a decorative feature as well as a way to halt erosion. I hope this answers your question somewhat good luck with your neighbor! They want us to pay for 1/2 of the repair. CA 92131 . It happens all the time. The neighbor said he gave notice ahead of time but has no proof and I never got any prior notice. Civ. Does this mean both neighbors are responsible for the cost of the retaining wall as well? Remember he What options do I have? If this sounds familiar then your in the right place and your problem is soon to be solved with The California Good Neighbor Law also referred to as California Civil Code 841 or The Good Neighbor Fence Act of 2013. You must then pay the contractor in full. The law becomes a little unclear in instances such as yours but the major factor which is going to decide who is legally responsible is whether or not you have a fence around any part of your yard that is connected to this fence that he wants you to pay half of to replace? I had not notified him yet of the contractor doing the job as it just got scheduled. Whos responsible? I appreciate your comment, but you must realize the majority of the time, these cases will be fought in small claims court by neighbors without much legal knowledge or without additional attorneys and the judge will likely follow the letter of the law. As far as the charging you for cleaning costs, etc. Do you know? I have no idea where your neighbor is getting his information from but it sounds to me like he is trying to take you guys to the cleaners, please whatever you do dont let him do that! It leaves me in this terrible circle. (1) A retail marijuana accelerator store license may be issued to a social equity TermsPrivacyDisclaimerCookiesDo Not Sell My Information, Begin typing to search, use arrow keys to navigate, use enter to select. Or, do I need to move the fence towards my house a few inches, and be solely on my own property line? While repairing is an option sometimes, although we usually do not recommend it, this article is based on the notion that your fence has fully failed, needs replacement immediately, and your neighbor refuses to pay for it. I understood and said whatever wood you do your fence we can get. 2. . Cal. We were gone for a free days, and the contractor had a job cancel, so he asked if he could come early and remove the fence. So you are presented with the same predicament? We cant afford the cost for the fence that he wants($14k). On the invoice, the contractor put good neighbor fence. Is this considered a good neighbor fence under these circumstances? I have owned my house since it was built, in the early 70s. I Said they should of waited till the house was under my name and I would of helped out. In California, Civil Code Section 841.4 governs what has commonly become known as spite fences. If one party refuses to cooperate, the other party can do any of the following: The definition regarding Join for Use is likely going to be a major factor in deciding who is legally responsible to pay. At FindLaw.com, we pride ourselves on being the number one source of free legal information and resources on the web. I was advised by the HOA board about Cal. Not only did you not own the house when it was replaced, but even if you did, they would have to give you a 30-day notice if you refused to pay half. Im looking forward to returning to your website. Im thinking giving up a few inches just to be sure he has not a single leg to stand on might be best. If you dont agree to her doing the job, which I would be very wary of and personally would never allow, then she has no choice but to pay for it all herself or you guys use a different contractor. The neighbor paying (if you are not splitting the cost) would have the right to insist that the good side be pointed towards his yard. My property is the second house from a corner, so I have 5 neighbors around my property. She is still refusing to do her part. By reading the law it seems like I dont really need his permission to build the fence due to its condition and previous incidents but Im trying to keep the peace. (b) (1) Adjoining landowners are presumed to share an equal benefit from any fence dividing their properties and, unless otherwise agreed to by the parties in a written agreement, shall be . I had the fence erected entirely on my property. He then complained about us buying expenseive material (6ft red wood) and did not want to spend that. Do we still split it in half? It just appeared one day. area let me know and Ill go talk to him! Location: It clashed with the style of our house. FindLaw Codes may not reflect the most recent version of the law in your jurisdiction. Yes, that is correct. I know this sounds very complicated and it is, so please try and answer the questions to the best of your ability! My neighbor put up a wooded fence 6 inches from the property line on their side of the property. Code 841, but my fear is that after having a letter certified to her, she will either ignore it or refuse after the 30 days. He then re does his 3 sides but not our shared said nor buy material for it or even ask us to go half for the cheaper material. Most houses have nothing between them in the front yards other than a concrete mowing strip or plants, if anything. I have no contract with the men who put up my fence since there both Nccrc union works who pick this up as a side job. Also, it would be good to know for the future in case it happens again. The only issue that will come into play is the short notice period or your case would be a slam dunk.. My neighbors want the fence between our houses done. Do owners of homes with pools fall under a different set of rules. The fence is over 25 years old and the entire fence could stand to be replaced. It benefits the homeowners as they now have a legal route to take to replace their fences, which obviously is exactly the reason the law was created! First off, the biggest one is if everything you say is correct, there was not a valid reason to replace the fence in the first place. https://california.public.law/codes/ca_civ_code_section_841. The quotes Ive gotten for a survey are from $750 to >$6000 depending on how much work they need to do, well in excess of the cost of replacing that portion of the fence. Two questions: There has never previously had a boundary fence. The fence is about 6 inside our side of the property line and is about 15 feet long, extending from our backyard gate towards the front yard/street. Please let us know what better route there is to take, I am sure all our readers as well as I would love to hear all the other options out there! I know personally, I would never get involved with such a situation! Triple damages. Or, I have to ask my neighbors' permission? poor maintenance, or sprinklers hitting the fence, etc., causing damage to the fence, therefore, causing the fence to have to be replaced before it should have with proper care and maintenance. Quoting California Civil Code 841. . The rest of the fence between our backyards is fine. The term good neighbor just refers to the style of the fence. In summary, I WOULD NOT pay your neighbor a dime, as he not only replaced a fence that didnt need to be replaced in the first place, but he did not follow the proper steps in order to be able to collect half the costs fro0k you via the courts. FindLaw.com Free, trusted legal information for consumers and legal professionals, SuperLawyers.com Directory of U.S. attorneys with the exclusive Super Lawyers rating, Abogado.com The #1 Spanish-language legal website for consumers, LawInfo.com Nationwide attorney directory and legal consumer resources. They have the planks on their side and our side has the 2x4s. They have refused, saying that that dont want us to have free access to their property-we would literally only have to take 4-5 steps on their property to get to our our property under the stairs. (2) Where a landowner intends to incur costs for a fence described in paragraph (1), The neighbor is requesting I pay for all the materials which is half the estimate and she and her handyman friend will do the work. Also during the raining season, we need to do the roof and siding work asap before the raining season. CA Civil Code Section 841. . -Was the retaining wall initially required because the lower neighbor graded their property and therefore it was their responsibility to provide support to the uphill neighbor whose natural support they cut away during the grading and leveling of the property. Many legal problems can arise otherwise. dividing their properties and, unless otherwise agreed to by the parties in a written We live on a hillside, so our backyard is 3 stories down. Therefore it seems to me she is trying to rip you off! Any owner or occupant of adjoining property Hi we live in a resort area and our neighbor who does not live full time at his home, wants a fence between our yards to keep his dog in, privacy, etc. I have a 5 acre property with no HOA or perimiter fence requirements. Must give adjoining landowner 30 days' notice before beginning work. in the yard, providing security & privacy, etc. I am currently dealing with a neighbor that is refusing to fix our shared fence. Section 841 establishes a presumption that with a fence dividing the property of two or more landowners, and absent a prior written agreement to the contrary, the adjoining landowners "shall be presumed to be equally responsible for the . If he followed these steps then he could go after you in court and would likely win. If you are not satisfied with the final product or it isnt what you had agreed upon prior to it being built, then you should not pay! In fact once you file the small claims suit and he is served most people will end up paying then because they dont want the hassle of going to court and they realize they will likely lose anyway. I would have appreciated knowing in advance as I have dogs. It is not something that NEEDS to be done. Since the water is now drawing towards my side of the property. Determine if a building permit is required for retaining wall construction. Can she insist on a new fence and I have to pay for half? agreement, shall be presumed to be equally responsible for the reasonable costs of Our side of the fence with the 2x4s looks ugly and unfinished. They told me that as long as I dont pay then Im not allowed to touch their wall at all and they were going to take me to small claims for them to collect what I owed them. (12) Retaining and site walls and their associated drainage systems shall not allow unintended water to pass beyond, around, or through . First off, please whatever you do, do not pay this man a dime. Then he said he would come up and build the fence and also move my gate for which I would pay him for and 1/2 the neighbor fence. The neighbor sent me the written estimate from the construction person that showed the same price, but did not say panels but said the fence would be built from boards. Spite Fence Law: 841.4. Persons. Which has become an eyesore. There was nothing wrong with previous wood fence it had while home was in escrow. My neighbor put up a 6ft wood fence 4 inches from the existing 6ft wood fence on their side of the property. Unless the fenceless owner someday decides to fence in his own property benefitting from the already existing division fence. or maintenance costs involved to address the problem, the proposed cost sharing approach, Since from what youre saying he did none of the above, he has no legal backing to pursue any money from you. Retaining Walls & Definitions A retaining wall is a wall designed to resist lateral earth and/or fluid pressures, including any surcharge, in accordance with accepted engineering practice. Any advice on how to proceed or deal with this overbearing representative? Code 3346. All dogs get out. Thank you, we try and post informative blog articles as much as we can but with the workload lately, sometimes it just isnt possible. Our neighbor just built a fence on the property line without any discussion with us that separates our 2 lower side yards, so we now have no access to the area under our side stairs. My name is***** I live in Alhambra, CA. I am very sorry to hear about your situation. Contact us. Property Lines: 829-835. This is due to the fact that the fence is not connected to another fence in your neighbors yard, therefore enclosing it. On our average bid, the material costs are nearly 1.5 to 1.75 the costs of labor. That 32 of fence is behind a large hedge and is not even visible from my property. Never gave us the opportunity to make a selection that matched our existing fence. Our neighbor, without talking to us, tore his fence down and had a vinyl fence put up. Shouldnt we have a right to easily access our own property? This definition also applies to freestanding pool walls. Also was there a fence there before that is falling apart. The fence falls after he rent it out to another family who as well as me has 3 large dogs. Call a minimum of 3 fencing companies, such as. Having said that if there are any specific questions or subject matter you would like to see some posts regarding, please let us know! My new neighbor just started replacing all his fencing in his backyard. The sides of our yard are 6 white vinyl. Hi RC fencing! I bought a newly built home in 2000. this information even though informative it only benefit the contractor. We are buying land. Personally I dont think they look as close to real wood as they need to. But the neighbors demand ourcontract is signed with the siding contractor, and demand the contractors license and liability and insurancecoverage. 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